Measuring Brain Fog

[James]

If James is reading this: what is the minimum amount of minutes to get a good reading?

You need a minimum of one second of data to calculate brainwaves How long it takes to get a "good" reading could be one second if you're using EEG gel and you put the band on correctly first time.
In the real world, it's dependant on two factors. #1 Putting the band on correctly and #2 Sweat formation.
You need a sweat band to form and how long that takes will depends on the persons forehead and the local temperatue/humidity.

For myself at home, I can get a clean RAW EEG signal in 10-20 seconds; faster if the headband is already warmed up from handling. I would point out that I have almost no hair though, which helps

[Transformation]

Hi James,

thanks a lot. I guess I got confused by the pop-up that warns to take average and asked the wrong question. So for the noob that likes smooth curves, how long would it take until they can be smoothened?
or would the "mind mirror" graph be correct even for a few seconds? I am planning to use it for
- evaluation of the brainwaves when waking up
- meditation
. different activies (talking, welking) that are strenuous for me

thank you!

[James]

Oh you mean the online charts warning? That's because the default setting on the top left is "Average Minutes".. so if you only have 10 minutes of data, that's literally just 10 points on the graph You can put in as little data as you like and it'll display, but it won't look like much unless you check "All Data Points". It's just a warning though, you can feed in whatever you like. Most people do 30 minute sessions from what I can tell with people sharing data with me.
To be clear, the graph data will always be correct, no matter how much or little data you put in!

[Transformation]

Thank you!
I was wondering also about the high delta and where you would normally see it.

[James]

Delta is the red line on the absolute graph.

[Transformation]

Thank you - I meant in which state the delta is usually that high.

But then I looked a bit further and have to say it was an artefact in my case from moving (duh). So I will experiment with non-movement to see where my brain is at currently.

[sleepyhobbit]

Hi Transformation,
Sorry to hear you have ME/CFS via Long Covid. That sucks. I hope you see improvements over the next year. I also use an electric wheelchair and it's been a game changer in terms of mobility and reducing crashes. I'll check out those articles you shared when I have some more energy. Have you tried the active meditation that comes with the Muse headset? I'm wondering if that will be a low-cost way to train the brain back towards healthier patterns. In case you're interested, here's a screenshot of one the experiments I ran to see how my brainwaves changed while doing a simple activity (watching TV). I shared this data with two neurologists and they more-or-less dismissed the data because they felt like Muse probably isn't an accurate source of EEG data. I also shared the data with a sleep doctor, and she said it was very unusual (if the data is accurate).

Brainwave Experiments for Severe CFS Patient.jpg (59.36 KiB) Viewed 3368 times

[Transformation]

Hi sleepy one,

It might be worth to check whether the signal quality is good (crisp lines, low amplitude in each sensor on the black and white screen). I come to understand that while moving delta goes up as an artefacr. So maybe try repeating the experiment but when you do rhe activity check the black and white screen to make sure rhe signal quality is ok.
I am looking at music as an easy way to shift patterns, also meditation and i read motorvisual movements are good for beta. I took up crocheting as i can do it lying down, let's see whether that helps.
Also am planning to write to the optibrain founder.i am not sure whether the algorithm would suit my needs but it wouldbe an easy way to train from bed if so.

[sleepyhobbit]

Thank you for the suggestion. I definitely checked signal noise at the beginning of each session (experiment) to make sure the headset had the best possible fit on my head. But... I didn't try monitoring signal noise throughout the entire session. That's something I should check out. Good thought.

[nande]

this is very interesting info, thanks a lot.
i've been working on my fatigue for several years, but i never reached such serious symptoms, and i've managed to improve my situation by trying several things.
interesting since my charts also have a considerable amount of delta, and beta is usually lower.

> maybe it really is the intent of the body to try and destress the aggravated nervous system in me/cfs patients?
that's really smart. in my experience this was the case at least in part.

have you ppl tried EMDR or toltec recapitulation?
Or other methods to address psycho/emotional stress?
i started both to address the fatigue, and it's one of the easiest and more powerful ways i've found.
i started learning about cptsd because of its relationship with fatigue and sensitivity to stimuli (light and sound etc).
This is the case in cptsd since the thalamus could be responding too much to stimuli because trauma can make it over-reactive.
both methodologies helps calm the nervous system and normalize the brain activity, allowing for the body to recover.
i've read much of this in the book "The body keeps the score" by Bessel Van Der Kolk, where he also states that there is correlation between trauma and auto-immune diseases, (he names rheumatoid ).
ADHD and cptsd share a lot of the symptoms and can be helped with some emdr as far as i know.

there's also mold toxicity (cirs) have you guys checked it out?

I hope you all get better, and wish you all the best in your journey.